Oct 3, 2011

Assault Drop List.

Okay, so I’m back. I had fun and it actually caused me to think what I was going to do with my life in the upcoming 4+ years (no joke). Anyway, I have a list!

This list is different from any of my others, mostly because I’m confident that it is an actual, good Close Combat Black Templars list. Shocking, isn’t it?

Okay, now let’s get started explaining, because I know that I would have some doubts. (Marshal Learoth, I know that you plan on looking into making Close Combat work for the Black Templar and you may have already thought of this idea, but here we go). I began by trying to see if I could make a good Close Combat list, and so the first thing I did was scratch out some numbers comparing the efficiency of Assault Terminators, Sword Brethren, and Crusader Squads. I had some of my numbers off and came up with Assault Terminators (after adding Transport) were on par with regular Crusader Squads (Powerfist, Meltagun, 2 Neophytes, Rhino) while Sword Brethren (PoLC w/ Terminator Honors, Power Weapon w/ Terminator Honors, Furious Charge, Rhino, only 5 members) strode ahead at 125% of the other two. This led my going to my collection of Black Templar units and their scores on the Metric System.

While there, I realized my mistake with the numbers and thought once more about how hurtful it is to Assault Terminators to require a Land Raider Crusader to be a viable unit (hard when your transport costs more than you do). And then I had a thought: What if they were in a Drop Pod?

So I tried a list, and here it is:

Emperor’s Champion: Vow (Accept); -140

3x Assault Terminators (5): 3 PoLC, 2 TH/SS, Furious Charge; Drop Pod; -245

Crusader Squad (6): BP/CS, Powerfist, Meltagun, Frags; Drop Pod; -157

5x Crusader Squad (5/1): BP/CS, Powerfist, Meltagun, Frags; Drop Pod; -151

3x Land Speeder: Typhoon Missile Launcher, Heavy Bolter; -70

Total Points:-1,997 (sorry, no place to spend the last three points)





Now, I did add the melee damage to DRPG and DLRPG from everyone, but I assumed that the vehicle moved 7”+. This is because, unless I have serious movement, they probably should. If I find them having not done so, bonus; otherwise, I’m expecting the worst. Everything has a bite in Close Combat, has a surprisingly good chance of killing a Rhino in one turn, and is a threat to Land Raiders (Typhoons and Assault Terminators being the most guilty culprits of failing this, and not even the Assault Terminators so much).

Assault Terminators are the main focus and are supported by the sheer number of Crusader Squads with Typhoons providing Fire-Support.

Possible Changes: I could change the Typhoons to MM/HF Speeders (I actually hadn’t thought of that before) and make them Suicide Melta that hopefully drops in when I have enough else close that it won’t get targeted. I would also need to find some 6 points and change that one sixth Initiate to a Neophyte. I could also convert two-three Crusader Squads to Objective Holders/Fire Support, rather than more Close Combat Squads, but I’m afraid that I am at the mercy of the Reserve Dice and am unwilling to risk mixed-troops. Normally, I’d take Power Weapons in small squads because I’m paranoid of 5-6 guys getting taken out before the Powerfist can swing, and if I needed the points then I probably would, but as it is I am more concerned about being able to kill Vehicles.

Flaws: There is the chance that I get the Pods in a bad order/at a bad time, which has a chance to have a lasting negative impact. The chance is there, but I’m not sure how it would actually happen, maybe getting all of the Assault Terminators early while everything else is late so that my opponent neutralizes them, or maybe the Typhoons come down by themselves first and get taken out which would have put me on the back-foot, or maybe all of the Pods would scatter off of the table and get enough destroyed results to ruin my chances. Another problem is that this list is in no way flexible beyond deployment, I just drop in and target things; after that I’m going to be mostly chasing my opponent around the board (unless he thinks he can take me in close combat, which is…possible? :P) . This means that against a Fast Skimmer Army I’m going to be dropping on objectives and going to ground until they decide that I’m dead enough to not threaten them (Pods can help with last-turn zooming onto objectives, but there’s no guarantee). The only way I could really beat a Skimmer Army is one of two things: 1) I win at objectives; or 2) my Typhoons/Meltaguns de-mech him, because my Terminators will only serve as meat-shields.

I don’t have much more to say about this, it has problems, and against certain lists it will do poorly. But how often do those come up? I suppose that against an army with an intense amount of shooting I would get beat up once I came down, and that will always be a negative of this type of list.


  1. Its not that I've not thought about it, I just don't like how it plays as much. I got the original idea from Stelek way back when, but after playtesting, decided it wasn't as effective as the defensive version.


    Bloodcrusade and I got into a little argument about both styles of play, which resulted in us both making blog posts about it.

    1) http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.php?showtopic=227158 (His)

    2) http://www.implausiblenature.net/1/post/2011/04/black-templars-drop-pods-well-get-it-sooner-or-later.html (Mine)

    You hit on pretty much all the pros and cons. I do think that the list is a little weak in the CC department outside of the Terminators, as it lacks the bodies to make a difference through weight of attacks. It is also 4 units lighter than my DDP list, so board manipulation is more difficult to accomplish. You also lost some firepower by adding the Terminators. However, your list is more suited towards killing things if the need is there.

    I think the list can be effective for sure, but i still believe that the pure defensive list is more effective against a wider variety of opponents. It might also be my preferences so keep that in mind.

  2. Oh absolutely, and it isn't preference. The DDP style (regardless of the specifics) has a superior strategy from the get-go. Really, this is just a disguised rock list that avoids the threat of being blocked/wrecked at the outset. If plan 'A' fails or is foiled, plan 'B' is to grab/contest objectives with whatever's left and hope the opponent doesn't kill the troops. If the opponent has no problem killing a unit of 5 TH/SS Terminators in one turn (or maybe longer during combat), guess who will have to rethink their strategy entirely? I just thought that it this was a neat idea.

    I could go for larger Crusader Squads, but I would lose Meltaguns and Drop Pods, which is a bad thing. Besides, it's not quite like they should get dropped right in front of something that can easily take them out (except for certain circumstances, such as presenting your opponent with two bad choices by doing so).

    This was influenced by the DDP list, but not quite based on it. The influences are mostly having a large number of Drop Pods on the field to mess with LoS and maybe movement, near excess troops to freely be placed on objectives, etc. And I guess that the Troops are quite similar (small numbers, Meltagun). I agree, Board Manipulation won't be quite as easy, but it isn't the goal. The goal is to drop down and kill things. Its got plenty of troops to also take objectives, so that isn't a worry, and enough Close Combat threat to take on any Close Combat army who isn't able to pick apart the units in small groups (such as by them dropping down gradually, or in different areas).

    As for the links (wow, the one from Implausible Nature is yours? Who'da thought?:)) I read Blood Crusade's post when I was researching Drop Pod lists when working on my own, and I remember reading yours at one point (probably soon after I found your website and had worked through the 101 guide, as that is about the right date for then). I had not seen Stelek's post, and I'm not sure I agree with him on the Crusader Squads, but it is sort of interesting.

  3. Heh. I just wanted to give you some idea of the attempts at making it work, in case you hadn't already seen them. I think the idea has merit.