Sep 17, 2011

List Building Part 3: Best shot at a Foot List for Black Templar.

Okay, another in the list building series and this time it’s about that Foot list I’ve been wanting to attempt.

Alright, every list needs Anti-Tank, Anti-Infantry, Mobility, Flexibility, Scoring units, Survivability, and finally Control. Meching up gives Mobility and usually Flexibility, so we’ll need to find other ways of achieving that. Scoring Units should be easy enough to get, we’ll be packing quite a few guns so both Anti-Tank and Anti-Infantry should be okay so long as we make sure to get more than enough Anti-Tank, and Survivability will come from both number of bodies and from screening units. Control is something I’ve not really mentioned before on here, but Disruption is a good example of some Control; it’s controlling your opponent’s movement, or when and where they can engage you, or what are their prime targets. Mech lists get control quite easily with cheap, mobile transports but for this foot list I will have some trouble, so we’ll have to see how it goes.

Now, you could claim that Righteous Zeal helps with Mobility but only a couple of units at a time, you can’t choose which units nor when they get the extra movement, and only in one direction. So no, RZ does not help there. It can be a nice benefit, but I’m more concerned about failing a test and falling back, which technically reduces my mobility.

Last thing before we begin, one of my goals is to not take any vehicles. Dreadnoughts may have feet, but they’re still vehicles and will thus be ignored.

First off, we’ll need a Marshal. Ld10 is going to be what let’s us ignore certain rules (RZ, Kill them All, Tank Shocking) to a certain degree. Give him a Combi-PlasmaGun and a Storm Shield for now, so that he can hurt things and take a beating. 110 points.

Now let’s decide which Vow we’ll take. Accept Any Challenge sounds enticing due to the sheer number of bodies that will be using it, and it gives something of Control in making us poor targets for Close Combat. On the other hand, Abhor the Witch saves us almost two Initiates and is our only defense against Psykers, more so because of how much of the board we’ll be covering (probably). For now we’ll take Abhor because of the lower price and the fact that this is going to be a shooting army, rather than an assaulting one. 110 points.

We need Anti-Tank, and we need more than in other lists. We have no choices from Heavy Support, and we can’t take Land Speeders. Assault Marines are terrible except in specific roles where they’re just bad. But Bikes are available. Maximum size with 3 Plasma Guns and a Multi-Melta Attack Bike is pricey (243 points) but is our best choice for now between its mobility and tank-popping ability. We probably won’t be able to afford three in the long run, but we’ll start with three of them. We could drop two of the Bikes without losing any of the special weapons, but that would make them juicy and vulnerable, so we’ll keep them if we can. 729 points.

Even with our Bikers, we need more Anti-Tank. While we’re at it, we might as well tap another good source of foot-based firepower, Terminators. Standard Terminator Squad with CMLs and Tank Hunters is 265; a Command Terminator Squad with one less Terminator to attach to the Marshal is only 225, so we’ll grab one of those. We can afford the Command and two regular ones. 755 points.

296 points left and we still need troops. Okay, a simple Las/Plas Crusader Squad is 101 points, so take two of those. 202 points.

94 points will give us four Initiates and three Neophytes to boost our weak Troops, but that really isn’t quite enough. Okay, drop a single Biker Initiate for another 32 points and get another Las/Plas Squad. 25 points left.

No, back to the drawing board; I can’t sit with only three minimum Crusader Squads. From the beginning, take six Missle/Plas Crusader Squads. 576 points.

Three CML Terminator Squads with Tank Hunters. 795 points.

Emperor’s Champion with Abhor and a Marshal with Storm Bolter and Storm Shield. 210 points.

Three pairs of Attack Bikes with Multi-Meltas. 390 points.

Change a Terminator Squad to a Terminator Command Squad, change three of the Missile Launchers to Lascannons, give those three Crusader Squads another Initiate, change the Marshal’s Storm Bolter to a regular Bolter and buy a Neophyte. 29 points.

2,000 points total.

But, how do we send squads over to claim objectives, move them and sacrifice firepower? No, drop those three extra Initiates, switch back to Missile Launchers, drop the Neophyte, and drop two Crusader Squads. That gives us 265 points for two more mobile Crusader Squads to claim objectives. Actually, drop the Marshal as well. He’s nice, but we just can’t afford him. So 321 points, or 160 points each.

80 are lost with the basic five guys. I’m tempted to make them into Close Combat squads, but I don’t think that will go over well enough. Give them Meltaguns and five Neophytes- no, four Neophytes and Frag Grenades. 159 points each.

Actually, drop a Neophyte from each squad and upgrade the Missile Launchers to Lascannons. 0 points.

Here’s the list:

Emperor’s Champion: Vow (Abhor); -110

Terminator Squad (5): CMLs, Tank Hunters; -265

Terminator Squad (5): CMLs, Tank Hunters; -265

Terminator Squad (5): CMLs, Tank Hunters; -265

Crusader Squad (5/3): Bolters, Shotguns, Meltagun, Frags; -148

Crusader Squad (5/3): Bolters, Shotguns, Meltagun, Frags; -148

Crusader Squad (5): Bolters, Lascannon, Plasma Gun; -101

Crusader Squad (5): Bolters, Lascannon, Plasma Gun; -101

Crusader Squad (5): Bolters, Lascannon, Plasma Gun; -101

Crusader Squad (5): Bolters, Lascannon, Plasma Gun; -101

Attack Bike Squadron (2): 2 Multi-Meltas; -130

Attack Bike Squadron (2): 2 Multi-Meltas; -130

Attack Bike Squadron (2): 2 Multi-Meltas; -130

1,995 Points.





I could drop a few Neophytes to give the two Melta Squads Powerfists, but I don’t think that the Powerfists would give enough punch to be worth it and we don’t really have excess bodies to drop. Maybe if a few of the Lascannons were changed back to Missile Launchers, but not as is and we can’t afford to make that change.

Alright, 15 Terminators, 37 Infantry, and 6 Attack Bikes. Does that compete with a dozen vehicles and 31 Infantry? No, not really. While I think this list could work if someone had some experience with it, maybe even make a try at a tournament, it is a far cry from what Black Templars can bring, and with Ld8 and RZ, I can’t keep my squads too close to the edge of the board or else I could easily lose them. Plus I can’t really hope to win Capture and Control missions, nor will I do well in Dawn of War. So I’m hurt straight off the bat more than half the time, that’s bad.

So there you go, my best shot at a Foot-List for Black Templars. Not really amazing, except for being an almost competitive foot list, but there it is. Any thoughts or suggestions? I’d love to hear them.


  1. Quick note: if you are 7" or less from the board edge, for Ld8 it is a 16% chance to lose the squad and for Ld9 it is a 10% chance.

    Took 21/36 which is the chance to roll a 7+ on the fallback and then multiplied by chance of a 9+ (10/36) or 10+ (6/36). It drops to 12% & 7% if you are just smidge past 7".

    In other words, you just have to take your chances. The two times I've lost Terminators that way (so far only Terminators have been injured in the placing of them too close to the board), in one I won anyway (it was the Assault Terminator squad so my firepower stayed up) and the other it still took other screwups by me to lose, but the point being, I still was in fighting trim and contesting for a draw and maybe squeaking in a win even after losing the Terminator squad.

  2. Actually, I don't really see much difference between being 25" from my opponent and being 29" aside from very specific circumstances, such as lucky run rolls. So all I can be farther from the board edge and have an even lower chance of running off.

    Of course, you've got what, two or three foot units that start near the board edge? In this list there are 12, most of whom are Ld8 and the Champion; so on average, assuming they all need to take those tests I'll lose one per turn to failed RZ if they start 8" away from the edge. Of course, I'd succeed a bunch of those tests which could allow me to move forward, perhaps into a more favorable position, but mostly this shouldn't really be a problem, instead just quite annoying should it happen.

  3. Usually three units (2xTHDC, 1xAssault) with Ld9. I've fought one foot list game, although at 1000 on a 4x4 board and I got the advantage of the first turn so I was able to move up one.

    That was actually one of my issues with the gunline Marshal Laeroth took to NOVA, that plinking at the lascannon squads could potentially cost the squad.

    The only foot list I've thought about was similar to my deep strike list, just turn in the pods and use the points to buff my Crusader squads will using the three Terminators as screening for 4+ cover saves while packing in max size Crusaders.

    EC-AACNMTO, 2xTHDC, 1xAssault, 2x9/6 Crusader w/ melta & frags, 2x5/0 with ML & Pg, 6xLS-Typhoon

    EC-AACNMTO, Helbrecht+9/5 Cmd w/ 2xmelta, apoc, frags & Furious Charge, 2xTHDC, 8/6 w/ melta & frags, 2x5/0 w/ ML & Pg, 6xLS-Typhoon

    Violates your no vehicle rule though. Definitely "Kill Them All" lists that would have to thrive on butchering enough troops to let me gain the advantage.

    Yep, there are several other variations I could think of, but haven't fiddled with yet.

  4. One thing about foot lists though, is that they need a ton of anti-tank firepower so that when they meet a meched oponent they can quickly and easily remove the Vehicle advantage and then they have the upper hand.

    You know, I've never tried to make a list using either of our Special Characters. I should probably do that sometime. But, of course, I will be getting my fluff started first (which I should really get started on, maybe I'll put it up by the end of the week).